Saturday, October 25, 2008

Doniger

Doniger’s chapter about women’s voices in myths raised a number of questions for me about the role and effect of women’s voices in narrative, and whether a woman’s narrative can be said to exist.
Doniger begins by citing the tradition of ‘old wives’ tales’. These stories were often physically voiced by women, and the implication is also that they were told for women. Yet what genders a particular story? Is it the physical narrator, the subject, the content, or the subject matter? Does the physical telling of a story mean that a woman has a voice in that particular story, or must ‘voice’ be something that is written into the material, rather than an agent of transmission? H.M. and N.K. Chadwick believe that there is female content in the story of David, and this is what makes the story ‘by/for’ women (Doniger 112), yet Holbek says it’s the subject, and the subject’s predicament that genders the story. However, neither content nor subject are guarantors of the story’s female-ness, for as Doniger points out, many stories with powerful women or goddess end with the women being undercut, subverted or destroyed in some way.
“Often the stories told by women do not seem to express a woman’s point of view at all” (Doniger 117) for sometimes the female narrator presents male bias, and sometimes the male narrator speaks sympathetically about women’s position. Although there is a problem with gendering a story one way or another and speculating on whether one story is for women, and another against women. One runs into problems, essentializing women to certain traits, and the other, of ascribing them a political agenda as part of their essentiality. Doniger points this out when she says that not all stories that portray women in a bad light are the sole products of men and likewise, stories that portray women in a good light are the sole products of women. She mentions qualities such as class, age, beauty, and race that are factors by which women differentiate themselves and denigrate one another in their stories. There is not always a common interest shared by old wives’ tales.
Another point that I found interesting was Doniger’s assertion that women’s stories were also the result of a subaltern identity absorbing the cultural mores of the dominant group, thus “even women authors will share the dominant mythology of their clture; they learn and assimilate the images that men have of them, and express those images in their own storytelling” (Doniger 119). Doniger seems to be drawing on the Foucauldian notion of modern discipline wherein discipline works in and through people to the point where it becomes second nature, and ultimately, natural. Story-telling occupies this liminal territory wherein on the one hand the authors can absorb and express dominant hierarchies in their stories, and on the other hand, have the ability to subvert them. This potential of subversion is also expressed, “just as the dominated often reproduce the opinions of the dominators, so it is also true, though less so and less well known, that the dominators mirror the opinions of the dominated” (122). And yet, while I agree that this is part of the process of the interaction between dominant and dominated discourses, I don’t see it as a 50-50 exchange. While I understand that one culture can be influenced by the culture it suppressed, in the way the European subject is constructed by its production of the Other, I think that Doniger gives the sub-altern a stronger identity than it actually has. In Spivak’s “Can the Subaltern Speak?” Spivak defines the subaltern as that “whose identity is its difference, there is no unrepresentable subaltern subject that can know and speak itself” (324). The subaltern by virtue of being the subaltern exists on the fringes, because it is the Other, not the Subject. It never speaks for itself, but is spoken to or spoken for. The subaltern does not have access to language, which is the property of the Subject, they are historically mute. Spivak points to the double silencing discourse of androcentrism and colonialism that construe the subaltern as Other, thereby denying it participation in the discourse of subject-hood: “Between patriarchy and imperialism, subject-constitution and object-formation, the figure of the woman disappears, not into pristine nothingness, but into a violent shuttling which is the displaced figuration of the ‘third-world woman’ caught between tradition and modernization” (Spivak 337).
This isn’t to say I agree with Spivak entirely either, for I think that Spivak exists at an extreme end of the spectrum, utterly denying the possibility of women’s vocality. However, it is useful for me to contrast Spivak with Doniger when it comes to the possibility of hearing women’s voices in the stories, whether they be old wives’ tales or otherwise. And after all that, I’m still undecided on the level of agency women’s voices possess in text…

4 comments:

Nathalie LaCoste said...

Hey Ada,

It is very interesting to think about how we define a "male" text and a "female" text. The question "what genders a particular story" is an important one as we often bring certain biases to texts which we read. I guess it is the human need to place everything into categories where we feel it necessary to differentiate between male and female, however on the other hand if we did not give "voice" to women's texts we may be at risk of losing them.

I wonder if it is at all possible to view stories from a gender-neutral point of view, or if this would take away from the story. Moreover, how does our understanding of gender influence how a text is understood?

(I feel as though I have thrown this back into the discussion of women's studies two weeks ago)

Mike Jones said...

Hey Ada
“Even women authors will share the dominant mythology of their culture; they learn and assimilate the images that men have of them, and express those images in their own storytelling” (Doniger 119)
I found this section interesting as well, and think it adds a problematic reality to any study on an ‘oppressed’ subgroup. Since we are all social beings, undergo socialization, have a certain habitus or whatever other sociological buzz word you want to throw here, people will often except whichever circumstances they are socialized into as the norm.

I’ve always wondered why, in these cases, some groups are more accepting of their social roles than others. Obviously, things like slavery were routinely fought against and seen as wrong by the oppressed (or maybe less obvious, since it would be difficult to ascertain that some societies socialized their slaves into accepting the role, like a more extreme serfdom). What if we consider a contemporary issue, such as the headscarf? Many people, both inside and outside Islam find the headscarf to be a sign of misogynistic oppression, but many woman who take up the hijab object to this classification, and say they are wearing it for pious reasons. Are the women who are defending a practice seen by some to be oppressive speaking as women? Have they just been socialized to accept their oppression? Are others wrong for assuming they are oppressed? I think it’s dangerous to reduce what a women’s saying as being simply a sign of another’s dominance because it takes away her voice as an individual.

A fascinating subject. Your post was thought-provoking as always and really forces me to broaden my scholarly horizons.

Anonymous said...

Hi Ada,

I found your discussion of the problems of gendered texts really engaging, especially the dangers of doing so, namely essentializing and generalizing. This is a topic I also found myself ranting about last week when looking at Kinsley's discussion of "women's religion"!

For this reason, I really appreciated Doniger's chapter, in which I think she attempts to redefine how we may find women's voices in texts that are not always representative of women or conventionally designated "women's texts". In contrast to this problematic categorization, Doniger opts instead to consider how a text is "female centered". In using this approach, she chooses not to classify a text as (in)appropriate for revealing a female's perspective. Rather, she leaves open the possibility that even texts authored by women can reflect the pervading social paradigms of their day, and might offer insight into the subjects not represented by what have traditionally been considered "female texts".

I also found your discussion of the agency of the subaltern in speaking for itself. I wonder though, even if we accept the argument put forth by Spivak here, does this preclude Doniger's point on the influence of the subaltern in shaping the European subject? While the Other is not privy to a voice of its own by Spivak's logic, the question of how its existence molds (if even silently) the dominating culture remains to be explored...

Great post!

unreuly said...

hey ada!
my thoughts are sort of in mirror of nat's...is it imperative to give gender to a particular text?

and to tangent from that a wee bit...are there particularly feminine myths? are myths gendered to begin with or do we gender them through textualization?